Re: (no subject)
Joe <[email protected]> Sun, 18 Nov 2012 14:06:30 -0500
| Newsgroups | gmane.comp.mobile.bitpim.user |
|---|---|
| Message-ID | <[email protected]> |
This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============3961899406877231837== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------030706050805090504070008" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------030706050805090504070008 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Spam is really annoying, but discussing it shouldn't be a reason for us to be uncivil to each other. You bring up some valid points. It is undoubtedly harder to spam a list like this by chance. Just for my own information, can you refer me to some evidence that your assertions are true? I belong to a number of non-technical lists that just can't be convinced to use BCC and once my address has unnecessarily gone out to 30 or more recipients for each list, it's vulnerability/availability goes up at least geometrically, if not exponentially. I would suggest a single warning email to the account (requiring a timely "human" reply) before banning it. People come to lists like this for support and should not be banned lightly. Of course, all of this is up to the moderator who is the only one who can take such an action. If he or she is good at reading email headers (I'm not), then a simple address spoof could be detected. But, if the address is spoofed, the list still gets it, so it's a problem even if it isn't the poster's fault. Knowing that would at least allow the moderator to send out a more polite banning message than "I don't like you and I don't like your computer either." Or worse yet, no message at all. 1) People don't usually let their computers send other people's spam on purpose. Very often, they don't know it's happening. If it's really a spam account, then there will almost certainly be no reply to a warning. If they are informed, maybe they will correct the problem. 2) I've seen spam using my email address and I run Linux, which, although it isn't invulnerable to such things, almost never gets "hacked" this way. In any case, "incompetent" people are not "bad" people and should be treated politely, even though their incompetence may cause situations like this that have to be addressed. Joe On 11/18/2012 09:50 AM, N4AOF wrote: > Oh yes, it is always "someone else's" computer that "got hacked" -- > BS on both counts -- the vast majority of these spam infestations come > from the person either getting malware on their computer or from the > person having given away their account information in response to > phishing, fake sites, social engineering, or harvesting programs that > offer to 'consolidate' all your mail accounts. > > The "someone else's computer" story CAN occasionally be true because > some botnet malware does change the "from" address on the email > (usually detectable in the headers) but that is rare overall and the > odds are nearly astronomical in any closed mail list (like this one > and Yahoo or Google Groups) because the changed "from" address would > need to match someone on the subscriber list. > > Bottom line: When we see spam here, it almost certainly came from the > account shown in the From address and usually the individual is far > from blameless. > > In any case, regardless of who might be at fault, there is only one > reasonable response for the manager of any mail list -- once an > address is used to send spam to the group, the manager needs to remove > and ban that account from the list to prevent its use for continued > spamming of the list members. > > > *From:* Joe <mailto:[email protected]> > *Sent:* Sunday, November 18, 2012 03:37 AM > *To:* [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> > *Subject:* Re: [BitPim-user] (no subject) > > Most of the time, somebody else got their computer hacked and all the > email addresses harvested and used without ever touching any of their > computers. Teach people to use BCC instead of CC or TO for mailings > so fewer addresses get unnecessarily propagated to vulnerable machines. > > On 11/17/2012 10:28 PM, Toby Fredrickson wrote: >> That happened to my Daughter on my Comcast account. She apparently >> switched over to "dookieprotect" (based on a fellow "stoodent" >> claiming it was the best) or something like it as malware protection >> and her box got zombied into a spam machine. We got it fixed. Any >> reputable virus system should fix that. >> >> On Sat, Nov 17, 2012 at 7:01 PM, N4AOF <[email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >> >> Another idiot who wants to claim his Yahoo account was "hacked" >> because he can't explain why his computer is sending out spam. >> >> >> > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Monitor your physical, virtual and cloud infrastructure from a single > web console. Get in-depth insight into apps, servers, databases, vmware, > SAP, cloud infrastructure, etc. Download 30-day Free Trial. > Pricing starts from $795 for 25 servers or applications! > http://p.sf.net/sfu/zoho_dev2dev_nov > > > _______________________________________________ > BitPim-user mailing list [email protected] > Unsubscribe or change options at > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitpim-user > > There are several hundred people on this list. Please be > courteous, on topic and follow the instructions before posting > http://www.bitpim.org/help/support.htm --------------030706050805090504070008 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit <html> <head> <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" http-equiv="Content-Type"> </head> <body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Spam is really annoying, but discussing it shouldn't be a reason for us to be uncivil to each other.<br> <br> You bring up some valid points. It is undoubtedly harder to spam a list like this by chance. Just for my own information, can you refer me to some evidence that your assertions are true?<br> <br> I belong to a number of non-technical lists that just can't be convinced to use BCC and once my address has unnecessarily gone out to 30 or more recipients for each list, it's vulnerability/availability goes up at least geometrically, if not exponentially.<br> <br> I would suggest a single warning email to the account (requiring a timely "human" reply) before banning it. People come to lists like this for support and should not be banned lightly.<br> <br> Of course, all of this is up to the moderator who is the only one who can take such an action.<br> <br> If he or she is good at reading email headers (I'm not), then a simple address spoof could be detected. But, if the address is spoofed, the list still gets it, so it's a problem even if it isn't the poster's fault. Knowing that would at least allow the moderator to send out a more polite banning message than "I don't like you and I don't like your computer either." Or worse yet, no message at all.<br> <br> 1) People don't usually let their computers send other people's spam on purpose. Very often, they don't know it's happening. If it's really a spam account, then there will almost certainly be no reply to a warning. If they are informed, maybe they will correct the problem.<br> <br> 2) I've seen spam using my email address and I run Linux, which, although it isn't invulnerable to such things, almost never gets "hacked" this way.<br> <br> In any case, "incompetent" people are not "bad" people and should be treated politely, even though their incompetence may cause situations like this that have to be addressed.<br> <br> Joe<br> <br> On 11/18/2012 09:50 AM, N4AOF wrote:<br> </div> <blockquote cite="mid:5A3A0F2DA8264B2AACEE20A1CC031E31@TomPC" type="cite"> <meta content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" http-equiv="Content-Type"> <div dir="ltr"> <div style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial'; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <div>Oh yes, it is always “someone else’s” computer that “got hacked” -- BS on both counts – the vast majority of these spam infestations come from the person either getting malware on their computer or from the person having given away their account information in response to phishing, fake sites, social engineering, or harvesting programs that offer to ‘consolidate’ all your mail accounts.</div> <div> </div> <div>The “someone else’s computer” story CAN occasionally be true because some botnet malware does change the “from” address on the email (usually detectable in the headers) but that is rare overall and the odds are nearly astronomical in any closed mail list (like this one and Yahoo or Google Groups) because the changed “from” address would need to match someone on the subscriber list. </div> <div> </div> <div>Bottom line: When we see spam here, it almost certainly came from the account shown in the From address and usually the individual is far from blameless.</div> <div> </div> <div>In any case, regardless of who might be at fault, there is only one reasonable response for the manager of any mail list – once an address is used to send spam to the group, the manager needs to remove and ban that account from the list to prevent its use for continued spamming of the list members.</div> <div> </div> <div style="FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLAY: inline; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: small; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; TEXT-DECORATION: none"> <div style="FONT: 10pt tahoma"> <div> </div> <div style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5"> <div style="font-color: black"><b>From:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true" title="[email protected]" href="mailto:[email protected]">Joe</a> </div> <div><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, November 18, 2012 03:37 AM</div> <div><b>To:</b> <a moz-do-not-send="true" title="[email protected]" href="mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a> </div> <div><b>Subject:</b> Re: [BitPim-user] (no subject)</div> </div> </div> <div> </div> </div> <div style="FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLAY: inline; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR: #000000; FONT-SIZE: small; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; TEXT-DECORATION: none"> <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Most of the time, somebody else got their computer hacked and all the email addresses harvested and used without ever touching any of their computers. Teach people to use BCC instead of CC or TO for mailings so fewer addresses get unnecessarily propagated to vulnerable machines.<br> <br> On 11/17/2012 10:28 PM, Toby Fredrickson wrote:<br> </div> <blockquote cite="mid:CAJ0fme6MS-zYxHiBODGpW9201jZmL=wK0gZk8_A7Yc3ra2h51g@mail.gmail.com" type="cite">That happened to my Daughter on my Comcast account. She apparently switched over to "dookieprotect" (based on a fellow "stoodent" claiming it was the best) or something like it as malware protection and her box got zombied into a spam machine. We got it fixed. Any reputable virus system should fix that.<br> <br> <div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Nov 17, 2012 at 7:01 PM, N4AOF <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:[email protected]" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">[email protected]</a>></span> wrote:<br> <blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class="gmail_quote"> <div dir="ltr"> <div dir="ltr"> <div style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> <div>Another idiot who wants to claim his Yahoo account was “hacked” because he can’t explain why his computer is sending out spam.</div> <div style="FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLAY: inline; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; FONT-SIZE: small; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; TEXT-DECORATION: none"> <div style="FONT: 10pt tahoma"> <div> </div> <div style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5"> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </blockquote> </div> </blockquote> </div> </div> </div> <br> <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset> <br> <pre wrap="">------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Monitor your physical, virtual and cloud infrastructure from a single web console. Get in-depth insight into apps, servers, databases, vmware, SAP, cloud infrastructure, etc. Download 30-day Free Trial. Pricing starts from $795 for 25 servers or applications! <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://p.sf.net/sfu/zoho_dev2dev_nov">http://p.sf.net/sfu/zoho_dev2dev_nov</a></pre> <br> <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset> <br> <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________ BitPim-user mailing list <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:[email protected]">[email protected]</a> Unsubscribe or change options at <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitpim-user">https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitpim-user</a> There are several hundred people on this list. Please be courteous, on topic and follow the instructions before posting <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.bitpim.org/help/support.htm">http://www.bitpim.org/help/support.htm</a></pre> </blockquote> <br> </body> </html> --------------030706050805090504070008-- --===============3961899406877231837== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Monitor your physical, virtual and cloud infrastructure from a single web console. Get in-depth insight into apps, servers, databases, vmware, SAP, cloud infrastructure, etc. Download 30-day Free Trial. Pricing starts from $795 for 25 servers or applications! http://p.sf.net/sfu/zoho_dev2dev_nov --===============3961899406877231837== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ BitPim-user mailing list [email protected] Unsubscribe or change options at https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bitpim-user There are several hundred people on this list. Please be courteous, on topic and follow the instructions before posting http://www.bitpim.org/help/support.htm --===============3961899406877231837==--