Re: State of Windows deployment in 2009?

On 2009-11-24, at 3:39 PM, Lachlan Deck wrote:

> On 25/11/2009, at 8:20 AM, Gaastra Dennis - WO Lists wrote:
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>> This is funny; however, from our experience, Apple does actually =
listen to us, and showing them an "i don't care" attitude will most =
likely result in us being stuck with 5.4.3 & Wonder, and Apple keeping =
WebObjects to themselves,
>=20
> This makes no sense to me. If they[1] *did* listen[2] then they'd have =
released WO 5.4.3.1 and 5.5 by now because that's what people have been =
asking about for quite some time. In fact, they tested the waters with =
quasi nightly builds ... but internal politics has seen the end of that.

Maybe they don't want to throw the new versions in front of a whole =
bunch of "angry lions". We all know about "internal politics", but =
realize that these are driven by people just you and me. IMHO, it is not =
always about the money, but also about people's emotions. If Apple's =
staff does like our tone, then why would they release new versions?

>=20
>> and we'll never be synchronized with the latest and greatest Apple =
versions again, because we think we can all do it on our own. Very =
smart.
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> The community has arisen in response to Apple pulling back (e.g., =
Entity Modeler was written because of Apple's decision to pull the =
tools). You've got it backwards I'm afraid.

Not really, IMHO, Apple is now recognizing the great contributions from =
the community, which might be better than their own. Eclipse/EM seemed =
an obvious progression; so why stand in the way?

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>> With Kind Regards,
>>=20
>> Dennis Gaastra,=20
>=20
>=20
> [1] by 'they' we mean Apple Computer Inc.
> [2] I know the WO devs at Apple themselves listen as I've had private =
conversations with a few of them and have had very good responses. They =
simply can't overcome internal politics.
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>> On 2009-11-24, at 12:04 PM, Anjo Krank wrote:
>>=20
>>> Jesus. Apple will do what they want. Nothing you, I or anybody else =
says or does will make much of a difference. Nor should we really care, =
it's not like they did something useful in the last 5 years or so.
>>>=20
>>> You sound like they were some sort of rain god. "Let's show we are =
loyal, or else HE might smite us like the flies we are!"
>>>=20
>>> Cheers, Anjo
>>>=20
>>>=20
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>>> Am 24.11.2009 um 20:36 schrieb Gaastra Dennis - WO Lists:
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>>>> If we want Apple  to release new WebObjects versions, beyond 5.4.3, =
to the community, the worst thing we can do is talking about Windows and =
Linux. We should be very clear about this: if we expect Apple to do =
anything for us in the regard, we should be loyal to Apple by only =
developing and deploying on Apple equipment. Otherwise, I am afraid that =
5.4.3 will be the last version we will ever see...
>>>>=20
>>>> With Kind Regards,
>>>>=20
>>>> Dennis Gaastra,=20
>>>> Chief Technology Officer,
>>>> WEBAPPZ Systems, Inc.
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
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>>>>=20
>>>>=20
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>>>> On 2009-11-24, at 10:19 AM, Kieran Kelleher wrote:
>>>>=20
>>>>> 1) The customer sometimes is willing to compromise and give you a =
Linux box ... deployment on Linux is as easy as Mac more-or-less. So, if =
they won't let you use Mac, ask if you can use Linux.... and setup =
CentOS or RHEL on it.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> 2) Project Wonder has source for Adaptors. I see IIS adaptor =
source in there. No idea how good it is:
>>>>>=20
>>>>> 	/Wonder/Utilities/Adaptors/IIS/
>>>>>=20
>>>>> HTH, Kieran
>>>>>=20
>>>>> On Nov 24, 2009, at 12:36 PM, Ralph Scheuer wrote:
>>>>>=20
>>>>>> Hello everybody,
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> due to the fact that some of our customers use Windows servers, I =
would be interested how others deploy their WO apps on Windows these =
days...
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> The wiki only refers to Apache when it comes to WO 5.4 on Windows =
and does not mention IIS...
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> However, some customers need specific IIS features like =
Single-Sign-On via ActiveDirectory or do not want another web server for =
political reasons.
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> How do you deal with that?
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> Is it still possible to use the old 5.2 adaptors (CGI or ISAPI) =
with modern IIS versions and WO 5.4? How about 64-bit-ness?
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> Would it be possible to set up WO 5.2 and just replace all the =
frameworks with the 5.4 equivalents so that at least the CGI adaptor =
(WebObjects.exe) from the old version works?
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> Has Apple ever released the source of the Windows adaptors so =
that they could be recompiled for 64-bit IIS?
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> Thanks for your input.
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> Ralph
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>>>>>=20
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>>=20
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>=20
> with regards,
> --
>=20
> Lachlan Deck
>=20
>=20
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