Re: FWB: Foss with benefits

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On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 9:29 AM, L.Cecilie Wian <[email protected]>
wrote:

>
>
> On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 8:45 AM, Charles Coss=C3=A9 <[email protected]> wro=
te:
>
>> Thank you Michael :)
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 12:39 AM, Michael Kesper <[email protected]> wrote=
:
>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> Am 05.02.2015 um 08:12 schrieb L.Cecilie Wian:
>>>
>>>> Now I may sound like I got bitten by Richard, but,  you keep saying
>>>> "open source",  not "free software". That matters. At least when you
>>>> send out  on this list.
>>>>
>>>> I will probably take a look at your project,  but it doesn't feel like
>>>> you are listening to marko . And you should.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Please please read your comments again.
>>> I'm very sad to hear such harsh comments when somebody proposes a tool
>>> for propagating knowledge about Free Software.
>>>
>>
> I meant to be strict, not rude.
> And i was annoyed by phrasing, where developers and parents was invited t=
o
> the discussion, not everyone on the list, thus disregarding the input you
> got. Glad that was not your intention.
>
>
>
>>> @Charles: Thanks for the info about your project!
>>> I think it's better to not create false dichotomies in people's mind:
>>> - Free Software (aka open source) is always commercially useable, that'=
s
>>> freedom 0
>>> - FSFE absolutely encourages building business models on creating,
>>> spreading, studying, using or improving Free Software!
>>> - As there's no free lunch, you've got to have some way to accept money
>>> if you want to build a sustaining infrastructure
>>>
>>> So, I'd cut out the "non-commercial" attribute and would paraphrase it
>>> differently, better explaining what you mean.
>>>
>>
> It looks like i'm missing an email here?
>
> Anyway, i'll go a little back and talk a littlebit about the semantics,
> because when getting into EDU what seems like a detail is huge.
> The non-comercial part is at first glance a good way of ensuring no-one
> takes your good ideas and run of with them, while ensuring the intended
> audience get to use the software. However be aware that a lot of schools
> and educators are actually in private sector and NC in a licence keeps th=
em
> from being allowed to use it, b/c they make money out of education. The
> other way to go about it is the GPL, and since you say you want that i
> think we are getting somewhere intressting.
>
> I'll have a closer look at your project now.
>
> When it comes to the very little amount of edu-software (on the list, but
> also everywhere else), it is so b/c it is a really hard thing to do. Not
> only to make technically a good solution, but one that interact with huma=
ns
> with edu in mind. However it is not impossible.
>
>
By the way, i think it is a good idea to take the inputs about the software
perhaps directly or via videoconferance. So we don't fill everyones inbox
with technical details. Or?



--=20
Cecilie Wian

"A ship is safe in harbor, but that's not what ships are for."*- Grace
Hopper / William G.T. Shedd*

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quo=
te">On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 9:29 AM, L.Cecilie Wian <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a=
 href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">likevel.katla@gm=
ail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D=
"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D=
"ltr"><br><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><span c=
lass=3D"">On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 8:45 AM, Charles Coss=C3=A9 <span dir=3D"l=
tr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">ccosse@gmail.=
com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"mar=
gin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,2=
04);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Thank you Mi=
chael :)<br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"=
>On Thu, Feb 5, 2015 at 12:39 AM, Michael Kesper <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:[email protected]" target=3D"_blank">[email protected]</a>&gt;<=
/span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px =
0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-l=
eft-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">Hi all,<br>
<br>
Am 05.02.2015 um 08:12 schrieb L.Cecilie Wian:<span><span><br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-=
left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;p=
adding-left:1ex">
Now I may sound like I got bitten by Richard, but,=C2=A0 you keep saying<br=
>
&quot;open source&quot;,=C2=A0 not &quot;free software&quot;. That matters.=
 At least when you<br>
send out=C2=A0 on this list.<br>
<br>
I will probably take a look at your project,=C2=A0 but it doesn&#39;t feel =
like<br>
you are listening to marko . And you should.<br>
</blockquote>
<br></span></span>
Please please read your comments again.<br>
I&#39;m very sad to hear such harsh comments when somebody proposes a tool =
for propagating knowledge about Free Software.<br></blockquote></div></div>=
</blockquote><div><br></div></span><div>I meant to be strict, not rude.=C2=
=A0</div><div>And i was annoyed by phrasing, where developers and parents w=
as invited to the discussion, not everyone on the list, thus disregarding t=
he input you got. Glad that was not your intention.=C2=A0</div><span class=
=3D""><div><br></div><div><br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(20=
4,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_ex=
tra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"=
margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,20=
4,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
@Charles: Thanks for the info about your project!<br>
I think it&#39;s better to not create false dichotomies in people&#39;s min=
d:<br>
- Free Software (aka open source) is always commercially useable, that&#39;=
s freedom 0<br>
- FSFE absolutely encourages building business models on creating, spreadin=
g, studying, using or improving Free Software!<br>
- As there&#39;s no free lunch, you&#39;ve got to have some way to accept m=
oney if you want to build a sustaining infrastructure<br>
<br>
So, I&#39;d cut out the &quot;non-commercial&quot; attribute and would para=
phrase it differently, better explaining what you mean.<br></blockquote></d=
iv></div></blockquote></span></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br></div>It =
looks like i&#39;m missing an email here?=C2=A0</div><div class=3D"gmail_ex=
tra"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra">Anyway, i&#39;ll go a little back=
 and talk a littlebit about the semantics, because when getting into EDU wh=
at seems like a detail is huge.=C2=A0</div><div class=3D"gmail_extra">The n=
on-comercial part is at first glance a good way of ensuring no-one takes yo=
ur good ideas and run of with them, while ensuring the intended audience ge=
t to use the software. However be aware that a lot of schools and educators=
 are actually in private sector and NC in a licence keeps them from being a=
llowed to use it, b/c they make money out of education. The other way to go=
 about it is the GPL, and since you say you want that i think we are gettin=
g somewhere intressting.=C2=A0<br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br></di=
v><div class=3D"gmail_extra">I&#39;ll have a closer look at your project no=
w.=C2=A0</div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extr=
a">When it comes to the very little amount of edu-software (on the list, bu=
t also everywhere else), it is so b/c it is a really hard thing to do. Not =
only to make technically a good solution, but one that interact with humans=
 with edu in mind. However it is not impossible.=C2=A0<span class=3D"HOEnZb=
"><font color=3D"#888888"><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div></font></span></=
div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>By the way, i think it is a good=
 idea to take the inputs about the software perhaps directly or via videoco=
nferance. So we don&#39;t fill everyones inbox with technical details. Or?<=
/div></div><br><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class=3D"gmail_=
signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_signature">Cecilie Wian<br>=
<br><h1 style=3D"margin:0px 0px 15px;color:rgb(24,24,24);font-weight:normal=
;padding:0px;font-size:14px;font-family:Georgia,&#39;Times New Roman&#39;,s=
erif;line-height:18px">&quot;A ship is safe in harbor, but that&#39;s not w=
hat ships are for.&quot;</h1><h1 style=3D"margin:0px 0px 15px;color:rgb(24,=
24,24);font-weight:normal;padding:0px;font-size:14px;font-family:Georgia,&#=
39;Times New Roman&#39;,serif;line-height:18px"><i style=3D"font-family:ari=
al,helvetica,sans-serif"><span style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:small;li=
ne-height:normal">- Grace Hopper /=C2=A0</span><span style=3D"color:rgb(0,0=
,0);font-size:small;line-height:normal">William G.T. Shedd</span></i></h1><=
/div></div></div>
</div></div>

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