Re: India's IP policies and US lawmakers.

On Tue, Jul 2, 2013 at 11:42 AM, Banibrata Dutta
<[email protected]>wrote:

> Well... hunger / starvation are nice bogies to rake up, when it comes to
> India, as are seers who sleep on bed of nails and rope climbing tricks !
> While hunger and starvation are facts, but using that as an excuse to
> avoid discussing or arguing about the social-righteousness of blatant /
> blind and unconditional patenting, is not acceptable.
>
> The real point of argument, which is being circumvented with all this
> smoke-and-mirrors talk is -- "fair usage of patenting". Since "fair" is
> subjective, it must be taboo -- right ?
>
>
Forget fairness of patents... here is an example of reputed university
behaving like a patent troll...

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/07/patent-wielding-boston-u-seeks-ban-on-apple-amazon-samsung-products/


>
> On Tue, Jul 2, 2013 at 10:50 AM, Ratnendra Pandey <[email protected]>wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> My reply generated some spirited response.  Links were thrown at readers
>> and  statistics from  some websites were referred to making Google richer
>> by a few cents in this process.   Some kind of statment was tried to be
>> made by quoting some numbers. Numbers crunching is better suited on finance
>> or accounting forums.  We generally discuss policy on this forum. And, this
>> particular thread is directly about policy.
>> So, I was expecting someone to justify a policy based on idea that
>> stealing is good or bad for economy.  I am still trying to get an answer.
>>
>> Anyway, Let me summarize my observations on what I saw in responses to my
>> post:
>>
>> 1. Socialism:  A fool-proof way to get angry response from some readers
>> is to mention India and socialism in the same line. I really do not
>> understand why should it be so? Has  the word socialism or socialist become
>> somekind of a slur word?  Why do some people feel insulted, or offended
>> when India and its policies on various issues referred to as a socialist
>> policy? Is use of word socialism during discussion considered  derogatory?
>> If the word  "socialist" or "socialism" has become a slur word, then it
>> is a matter of grave concern because the Constitution of Indian mentions
>> the word socalism in its preamble and says  what India is: "SOVEREIGN
>> SOCIALIST SECULAR DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC".
>>
>> So, the Indian people who get offended by the word socialist are either
>> ignorant that India is a socialist country, or the Indian education has
>> failed in instilling  the pride and confidence in the socialist identity.
>>
>> 2. People dying by falling from trains in Mumbai:  I deliberately
>> presented this example because the people who die by falling from train are
>> victim of socialist policies.
>> They do not die from some random accident. These people hang from window
>> railings, or door bars, or anything else that they can get there hands on
>> because the trains are  crowded that there is no space inside.  The odds
>> are against them. These people generally suffer from a disease far more
>> deadly and prevalent than cancer. This diesease is commonly known as
>> hunger. Some people call it starvation. These people have to make a very
>> difficult choice of dying of starvation or dying by falling from train.  A
>> person suffering from cancer can live for a long time. But, I have not
>> heard of any hungry or starving person living for more than a few weeks or
>> month.  The Indian railway which claims to be run on socilist polcies has
>> failed in providing a safe transportation to users. Such deaths can be
>> easily avoided by making sufficient investment in transportation
>> infrastructure. This can be done without stealing IP.
>>
>>
>> 3.  The fact that Indian education  has failed to produce innovators and
>> problem solvers who can be counted on to solve India's problem is self
>> evident.  I will leave it to the link-searchers and number producer to use
>> the search skills to dig out the statistics using Google (or some open
>> source search engine if available).  I am more worried about the vicious
>> circle that India seems to be stuck in. Its ill-effect are two fold. First,
>> we are not creating  system, or process, to solve the problems of India due
>> to not having enough problem solvers amongst us.  Second, we are not
>> leaving enough role-models for the generation next to learn from and get
>> inspired from.  So, do not expect much from the next generation if the
>> current generation does not know what it is doing.  Look at the current
>> ones first.
>>
>> In my previous post I wrote. "The system that produces people who want to
>> steal, also produces the people who sit in judgment,  through Supreme
>> Courts, high courts, or other regulatory bodies. "
>>
>> May I add that  the system also produces people who  write tirelessly in
>> media and discussion forums  to justify violation of property rights.
>>
>> 4.    For someone who  really wants to help cancer patients with
>> expensive drugs, an ethical response could be to pool their money and buy
>> drugs for the patients rather than stealing it from the IP owner.
>>
>> There are a number of  legitimate ways to help poor and needy.  But,
>> stealing is not one of them.
>>
>>
>> Sincerely,
>> Ratnendra Pandey
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> From: [email protected]
>> To: [email protected]
>> Subject: RE: [india-gii] India's IP policies and US lawmakers.
>> Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2013 12:54:09 -0700
>>
>>
>> Ashjit,
>> I am glad you asked. But, a better question would have been what the
>> supreme court ruling means to Indians and India.
>> As far the patent holders are  concerned, to them  it is a loss and any
>> loss, howsoever small , is still a loss.
>>
>> As far as I can tell,  US government is not going to scramble B-52
>> bombers to destroy the plants where these drugs are produced illegally, per
>> the US law.
>> But, we are
>>
>>
>> I have different perspective on this matter to analyze cost and benefit
>> allowing India to produce drugs from stolen IP.
>>
>> A far more number of people die every year in India for simple things
>> like dirty water or dirty air.
>> India does not need to steal expensive IP  to save her people from simple
>> and avoidable deaths like those from simple diseases  like cholera,
>> diearreaha etc and from other simple causes like death by falling from
>> overcrowded trains in mumbai suburban system. As far as I can tell from my
>> unscientific observation, the number of people who could be saved by drugs
>> from stolen IP are very few (any idea how many patients die from cancer
>> than from other waterborne and airborne diseases)?
>> But, you see, in socialist countries like India where government has to
>> showcase what it is doing, revoking patents on cancer drugs is likely to
>> get more votes than saving thousands of people who die every year from
>> simple things like cholera.  It also stokes felling of nationalism when
>> Indian government is seen as fighting a profit seeking American drug
>> company.
>>
>> Cancer is never epidemic. At anytime it affects a very limited number of
>> people.  A few cancer patients might be saved by these drugs. Not all
>> patient will survive even with these drugs. So for the benefit of  a very
>> small minority of patient who were unfortunate enough to suffer from
>> cancer, we are subjecting the rest of 1.2 billion Indians to moral
>> corruption and unethical environment that comes from stolen IP or living
>> off someone else's hardwork or money.  So much for the self-reliant
>> Indians. Is eating stolen food or treating with stolen drugs
>> self-reliance?
>>
>> But, the damage to Indian psyche and character caused by stolen IP is far
>> more than the benefit that might come from it. I have not heard of anyone
>> attaining wealth or prosperity from robbery or stealing. Karma, good or
>> bad, always catches up.
>>
>> Just look at what happened in last twenty years. Indian joined the IT
>> revolution in its infancy, but today, twenty years later,  India is no more
>> than a supplier of a  large number of cheap H1B type workers.
>>
>> When Indian foreign minister or other official visits Washington, they
>> invariably ask their US counter parts to increase H1-B visa.  I just fall
>> into shame when I try to visualize the situation in which the Indian
>> minister or negotiator looks into eye of an American bureaucrat and starts
>> the beggary.   "Madam, hamare bachhoon ko H1-B visa de do. [ Madam, can you
>> give H1-B visas to our kids?].  It is a shame that in the last twenty
>> years, India could not upgrade itself from being a supplier of large
>> manpower and not much more. What is more shameful is that Indian economic
>> system is incapable of absorbing its own supply of human resource.  By the
>> way this all happened when you had  a Prime Minister who is a Gold Medal
>> Winner and a "Topper" besides being a recipient many honorary doctoral
>> degrees.
>>
>> The best from India, yes from one of those IITs, a system of  white
>> elephants that guzzle a large amount of taxpayers money each year to
>> produce sub-par engineers most of whom are no better than engineers
>> produced at the likes of Tolaram Moolchand College of Science, Engineering,
>> and Technology, Benampet, Hamara Pradesh.
>>
>> Just look at this contrast. The smartest Indian kid can solve 300 IIT
>> style question in 3 minutes, a feat that an American kid can never
>> achieve.  However, every so many years, an American kid comes up with some
>> simple and innovative idea that changes the shape of the economy. A
>> Microsoft, Facebook,  Google, or Apple is created and the best Indian minds
>> are hired  to do the repetitive work.  An Indian minister begs for H1-B
>> visas.
>>
>> Indian system has failed in giving character so badly needed to be
>> original, innovative, and risk taking. Rot learning is encouraged.
>> Stealing is justified in one way or another. An impression is generally
>> created that progress is not possible without using unfair means. The
>> system that produces people who want to steal, also produces the people who
>> sit in judgment,  through Supreme Courts, high courts, or other regulatory
>> bodies. So, you get the ruling of the kind Supreme Court gave justifying
>> stealing patents.
>>
>> When I was a small child, I was raised with an idea that when wealth is
>> lost, nothing is lost; when health is lost, something is lost;  and when
>> character is lost, everything is lost.
>>
>> I am saddened to see that Indian  legal system encourages immoral
>> activities that will further degrade  Indian character and ethos.
>>
>> We will never be independent, innovative, and original so long as we are
>> encouraging unethical short cuts.  Not being able to stand on our feet is
>> far more  damaging to India than anything else.
>>
>>
>> Sincerely,
>> Ratnendra Pandey
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> From: [email protected]
>> Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2013 22:17:01 +0530
>> To: [email protected]
>> Subject: [india-gii] India's IP policies and US lawmakers.
>>
>> Can someone shed light on which IP policies they are talking about here:
>>
>>
>> http://www.livemint.com/Politics/7OHPpGiNbNqk5r0UI3USDN/India-not-willing-to-play-by-the-rules-US-lawmakers.html
>>
>> “Like all of you, my blood boils when I hear that India is revoking and
>> denying patents and granting compulsory licences for cancer treatments or
>> adopting local content requirements,” he said. “As a nation, we should
>> handle India like my dad did when I was growing up and I made his blood
>> boil: He put his arm around me and or pulled me where he would go, to make
>> sure his fingers were resting firmly on my shoulder just to inflict some
>> pain if I diverted from the course we would go down. That’s what we should
>> do with their government,” Olson said. (Congressman from Texas)
>>
>> --
>> Regards
>> Ashijit
>>
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>
>
> --
> regards,
> Banibrata
> http://www.linkedin.com/in/bdutta
> http://twitter.com/edgeliving
>



-- 
regards,
Banibrata
http://www.linkedin.com/in/bdutta
http://twitter.com/edgeliving

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